D/s in a blended family
One of our readers (justdave) asked how we handled our relationship with kids around, particularly since we are a blended family. It was great timing, because there was a thread about this topic over at Fetlife that got a bit ugly (in part thanks to me, I’m afraid). I think the problem was that people who aren’t 24/7 have trouble with the distinction between kinky sexual play and relationship dynamics (eg a bedroom submissive said “most relationships with unequal power are abusive” WTF???). This was exacerbated by the fact that the issue is not a black and white one, as many would like it to be. Anyway, I’ll tell you what we do and why, and I’m curious to hear what others do and what they think about all this.
What we don’t do
We don’t do or say anything sexual around the kids. Well, except they are in their early teen years, so they make off-color jokes a bit and we don’t stomp on that. So, just like most vanilla couples, we save the groping and deep kisses for when we are alone. We also save the spankings and bondage and dirty talking for when we are alone. Most but not all people would agree with this.
I personally don’t make this choice because of the children’s age, I make it because they would not be consensual participants if we were sexual in front of them. I make the same choice about exposing other people (family, friends, strangers on the street) to my sexual behavior. Note that I am not saying “my kink”, because I feel this about any kind of sexual behavior, not just kinky behavior.
This last point is a gray area, because you could also make the argument that people (adults anyway) SHOULD be exposed to more kinky sexual behavior, so that they realize it is…common (was gonna say normal, but maybe not :)). Certainly I would fight very hard to support gay couples’ right to hold hands, be affectionate and kiss in public (maybe not so much the genital groping but whatever). So for those of you who WANT to be led around by a leash in public, I say go for it! I’m a little less thrilled by the what seems to be common Domly desire to require a submissive to leave her panties for an unsuspecting waitress, but again, whatever.
In the Fetlife thread I referred to earlier, a few people said they’d be really irritated if someone was behaving kinkily in public in front of their children, because why should they have to explain that to their kids? I don’t have much sympathy for that point of view. My kids learned about gays very early in their life, because they have both lesbians and gay men as relatives. It was an easy, no-brainer conversation: “Some women like men, some women like women. Aunt Beatrice likes women.” My kids were kind of like “OK. Can we go play now?”
Honestly, I would welcome the opportunity that some public BDSM behavior would offer for a conversation with my kids. Sadly that is unlikely to occur where we live (I so fantasize about moving to San Francisco). However, I’ve had a couple of good, introductory conversations with my eldest child who is a BIG fan of Twilight. Any of you read Twilight? OMG, Edward (the vampire) is a TOTAL Dom, and Bella is waaaaaaay submissive. My girl got very sad after reading the first book because she said she would never meet a guy like Edward. We talked about what she found appealing in him. Dangerous but nurturing. Protective but domineering. Aggressive but gentle. Completely focused on Bella. I finally said “Dude. Check out your stepdad. Is he not Edward?” And it was like a light came on. She got it.
Since then, she has started conversations with me about sexuality (we had the “where do babies come from” a very long time ago). For one thing, she wanted to know if she was a lesbian, since she thought women’s bodies were really beautiful. I said a) no, and b) it would be okay if you are, as long as you c) still have grandbabies for me (she knows the last is a joke). She also wanted to talk about Edward and Bella’s relationship more, and we ended up talking about D/s and power exchange and switching and role playing. I didn’t speak specifically about Richard’s and my relationship, but I did tell her that I was submissive. She was so open and interested that it kind of blew me away. Which I said. It was a really wonderful talk.
What we do
I call Richard “Daddy” and he calls me “baby girl” in front of the kids. The first couple of times it slipped out, I got embarrassed and a bit worried, but they didn’t even notice. When I worry about it, I remind myself that it is very much a white, middle-class “issue”. African American and Hispanic women often call their man “Daddy”. My kids have friends of many ethnicities and cultures, and I just don’t think they notice stuff like that. In fact, my grandmother called my grandfather Daddy (he called her “Momma”, not “baby girl” however).
I am always respectful and deferential to Richard in front of the kids. And he is to me as well. He insists on opening my car door, he won’t allow me to carry packages, he won’t eat until I sit down at the table. My little one now races Richard to get to my car door! Isn’t that sweet? I love it that my children are seeing their mother treated with respect and love.
The main way we behave differently from a vanilla couple is that he will occasionally command me in a teasing way and…I always respond by doing what he says. In any other relationship I would have argued or said “fuck off” if someone had done that. The kids definitely notice this and I’m not sure what I think about that. One nice thing is that they will tease me now too. If I kind of “talk back” one of them will say “Oooooh you’re gonna get it now Momma!” and laugh and offer to help Richard catch me if I run away. So I guess they see it as flirting; certainly it is always very light-hearted and loving.
The part of this that I guess I am still wrestling with is that I am NOT a “taken in hand” wife. I don’t believe that God wanted men to be Dominant and women to be submissive. In many ways our relationship looks like a traditional one, and I feel extremely comfortable in it, but I don’t see it as inherently more desirable or natural than (for example) a FemDom/malesub relationship. I guess I’d rather my kids know that I’m kinky than to think I’m June Cleaver. If that makes any sense at all.
*I posted this and kept ruminating about that last line. “I guess I’d rather my kids know that I’m kinky than to think I’m June Cleaver.” It resonated with me so strongly. I realized, and want to clarify here, that what I want my kids to get from our relationship is that alternative sexuality/relationships are fine, NOT that women should obey their husbands. Thinking about that, I guess I am going to have to have some kind of a sit-down with them at some point. I will continue to ponder this. Another example of why writing a blog is such a positive experience.
Well, I’ve gone on and on and on, and I have grilled pizzas to make for dinner tonight (Hawaiian for the kids; something less fruity for us). I’m sure I’ve forgotten a million things I wanted to say, but maybe you will say them, or I will make another post or maybe they’re just not that important.xoAmy
Amy, I had to laugh. “I guess I’d rather my kids know that I’m kinky than to think I’m June Cleaver.” I feel the same way. Mine is more of a Taken in Hand relationship, but that is because it happens to be my kink. I take so much pleasure and enjoyment in taking care of Him, and our family. I suck big time at it, but I enjoy trying. I don’t know if I am explaining it well, but I do understand. I happen to know for us that he finds me incredibly feminine and sexy when I take on the June Cleaver role. I guess what I mean is that I would rather my kids know it is something I chose than something that HAS to be or that is the “norm”.
I agree too with the “a) no, and b) it would be okay if you are, as long as you c) still have grandbabies for me (she knows the last is a joke)” I have said this for years.
Comment by His.stormy — July 26, 2008 @ 7:31 pm
I’ve not had time to read her twilight series - but now im going to have to MAKE time!
I think it is good you had the conversation when she asked questions. Your relationship with her seems much like mine with my children. Ask and I’ll tell you honestly. I have NEVER hidden anything from them when they ask. EVEN MORE SO about sex and all things of it. I would rather they get the RIGHT (or what i know as right) information from me or another adult then from their inexperienced friends.
I totally agree with your standpoint on gay/lesbian relationships. I have told mine the same thing!
June Cleaver - um - many things you may be.. but June Cleaver… NEVER! But hey.. we may never know this for a fact.. who’s to say she was not begging her husband to tan the ass he owned after all were in bed and asleep???
Comment by Juli — July 26, 2008 @ 7:38 pm
Wow, what a great post.
I wish I could have a relationship like that. And yeah, I agree with every point you made.
Comment by Chantal — July 26, 2008 @ 7:45 pm
What a wonderful post, Amy!
I missed that thread over on fetlife but, seeing as I agree with you pretty much 100%, maybe that’s a good thing? Lol.
I always say I’m a kinky June Cleaver since I’m a stay at home mom.
Comment by Carrie Ann — July 26, 2008 @ 7:59 pm
Great post, thanks for sharing. The only thing I can say is that I don’t think of your relationship with Richard as kinky at all because it is to me, a traditional relationship. You defer to his wishes and he treats you like a princess with all the respect coming from both sides. You are allowed to express yourself but you realize the intrinsic value of the basic ego stroking that every man needs just as Richard realizes the value of the basic security that you need. That translates to being protected, being taken care of by someone who is “stronger” than you, thus you get to revel in your femininity while he gets to revel in his masculinity and strength. I am tired and I know this isn’t coming out right but I hope you get what I’m saying. I don’t mean “ego stroking” as a bad thing, it’s just those pats on the back that a man needs to feel he’s doing his job, taking care of his woman, his family, etc. Crap, this just isn’t coming out right so I’ll go to bed now!! Love your blog and would love to hear your experience at the club you went to when Megan was still living with you.
Comment by jdsgirl — July 26, 2008 @ 9:38 pm
Like Carrie Ann, I missed the Fetlife discussion. Probably a good thing - I’ve done enough ranting on the topic over the last years already.
I want to raise a daughter who’s a feminist. If she decides or is a submissive feminist that’s her own choice - but it’s a decision I want her to be qualified to make.
We’re not at the point yet where I have had to explain power dynamics beyond answering simple questions in response to discussions she’s unintentionally overheard. Things like “Daddy is saying that he doesn’t like it when men hurt women,” when we’ve discussed an abusive situation that’s made the local news here. Or “Yes, most girls do marry boys. But girls can marry girls, and boys can marry boys. You’ll get to decide that when you grow up, too.” (We live in California, after all.)
Thank you for speaking up.
sparkle
Comment by sparkle — July 26, 2008 @ 10:48 pm
stormy, I think you said it better than I did - “I would rather my kids know it is something I chose than something that HAS to be or that is the “norm”.” I am definitely an earth mother type, and I love fussing over Richard, and my babies and my dogs and my garden. Thanks for saying that.
Juli, I am not big on YA fiction in general, but I really loved reading Twilight, and it was fun to share that with my daughter. I snorted out loud when I read your June Cleaver comment btw. I think we’re probably going to hell for joking about her.
Chantal, It was a long, long time before I got this relationship, and worth the wait. I hope you don’t have to wait as long as I did. xox
Carrie Ann, It’s great to see you here AND at Fetlife. I’m afraid I wasn’t on my best behavior in that thread, but I was stunned that someone who identified as a sub would make such sweeping statements about D/s. Gah. I haven’t posted much there since.
jdsgirl, ooOOOOooo we are so kinky! hehe. No, I think I know what you’re talking about. The way we interact in front of the kids is not kinky. Some of the ways in which we interact could be seen as quite traditional (eg my deferring to his decisions, his protecting me). But the stuff that happens in the bedroom is definitely kinky! And in other ways we have quite a non-traditional relationship (eg I am the primary breadwinner and Richard is the primary homemaker).
xoAmy
Comment by Amy — July 26, 2008 @ 11:04 pm
I truly believe in being open and honest with my kids. I haven’t been a perfect mom, but holy shit those two have turned out to be spectacular people. That was an amazing post, Amy. Being who we are and being mothers is always a fine line to walk. But the best gift we can give them is integrity and honesty.
Comment by sulpiciapast — July 26, 2008 @ 11:47 pm
Like everyone else, the June Cleaver sentence really struck me. But it’s an important distinction to make. It’s tricky stuff, negotiating sexuality with kids. I realise as well, every so often, how so many people’s gut reaction to anything they see as subversive is negative - I’m not talking about kids, but just out in the real world. As usual, I guess we just have to lead by example with our kids, in being open to their curiosity. At least when your kids do work out the dynamic in your relationship they will have had the opportunity to see how it works in a loving, supportive and mutually fulfilling relationship (even with the Ick! My parent have sex?! factor
).
Comment by Z — July 27, 2008 @ 3:28 am
“I guess I’d rather my kids know that I’m kinky than to think I’m June Cleaver.”
My mother once said in a family therapy session that she was worried that she’d raised me to be a doormat because she deferred to my father a lot when I was growing up. The irony was that I still see her as one of the biggest feminist and non-doormat influences in my life. I saw a lot of her deference not as being a doormat or a proper housewife or anything, but still see it as a product of what worked for our family growing up. I learned much more that I could be and have my relationship in whatever way worked for me, rather than learning that I must always defer to a man or my partner. Of course, I’ve since made the decision to be in the M/s relationship I’m in because it makes me happy, but nothing from my parents relationship told me that I had to do it this way.
While my parents don’t to my knowledge know I’m kinky, I wear my collar constantly so if they’ve thought about it, they probably know. My master and I wouldn’t be surprised if they had some level of kink in their lives (especially power exchange), but it’s on the level of things we just don’t really talk about, although I think the space is there for the dialogue if I were to choose to have it. And I think their general openness to other people probably contributed to the fact that I never really beat myself up about being kinky.
Comment by alyson — July 27, 2008 @ 5:04 am
Oh yes.. I’m probably going straight to hell… however it wont only be for that! LOL
I have often said much as your living - why cant i just have a nice guy who loves me to take care of him, the children and the house and he takes care of ME? (grant you i have that now - will be better when i move) I as well have often said i should have been born in the 1940/1950. I would (with enough kink) been happy as a clam then.
Again… June Cleaver is fine.. but turn it up a notch or 12 million once the kids are in bed will ya???
Hey…. i swear… there is NOTHING like making homemade bread first thing in the morning with your bottom still smarting from the GREAT play from the night before!!
Like Mikey commercials… I tried it.. “Hey Amy!! She likes it!!!!”
Comment by Juli — July 27, 2008 @ 6:48 am
A wonderful, thoughtful essay, Amy, and a great follow-up discussion.
I loved your reference to letting things slip in publicly (like Richard’s issuing a command), but in a teasing way. I find there is so much that I do automatically, always in fact with an undertone of teasing, however slight (except if I’m in subspace, which happens with embarrassing ease), so I hope that my friends took it as the bantering of an affectionate couple when I said “Yes, Sir” in response to his order to bring him a cup of tea. Similarly, he sometimes would call me “kitten” without thinking, as it is in fact the only name he uses for me without great effort. Again, I hoped it would pass for a normal affectionate nickname, and that it would never cross their mind that he likes to lead me around by a leash or make me lap milk from a bowl on the floor
Comment by oatmeal girl — July 27, 2008 @ 9:51 am
sparkle, thanks and I totally agree re the raising a feminist thing.
sulpiciapast, “holy shit those two have turned out to be spectacular people” - the best possible evidence that you have been the best possible mother. An important thing to remind yourself of right now. xoxox
Z, that is a really good point, that most people see anything subversive as negative. I want to think about that some more. Thanks.
alyson, thanks so much for giving a kid’s-eye view of it, and letting us know how well it turned out in your case!
juli, I think if I’d been born in 1940 I’d be one of those bitter, twisted women that so many of our mothers became because they were smart but stifled. Your image of baking bread with a spanked ass was way hot, btw!
oatmeal girl, I do the inward jump when I accidentally say “Yes sir” too! I love it when you write about him calling you “kitten” - that is such a sweet and sexy nickname, and I don’t think it would make anyone think of BDSM, honestly. Hope you’re doing well.
Comment by Amy — July 27, 2008 @ 10:56 am
I don’t think there is anything I can add to what’s been said, but that was a great post. Luvbunny and I have talked about the day when our daughters ask us about our relationship. We have followed the “honesty is the best policy” rule since they were young, and intend to continue with that.
They have figured out a little bit, as they will tell luvbunny that she’s gonna get it when she gets sarcastic with me. lol.
*makes a note to check out “Twilight”*
Comment by Dragon Mage — July 27, 2008 @ 9:24 pm
I emailed you, but after I did, I went and looked up the name of the book that I was talking about. It’s Companions of the Night by Vivian Vande Velde, also a YA vampire story (and I don’t even like vampire stories, typically). The main male character is def a Dom, and I like the book so much when I was younger that I wrote the author to tell her how much I liked that character. I really didn’t get it at that age though, why I was so attracted to that character. The great thing about this book, though, is that the female counterpart isn’t just a submissive. She’s a really strong character, not just a stereotypical pushover. Of course, I haven’t read the book since I was about 13, so maybe it isn’t as good as I remember, but hey, maybe you guys would enjoy it too. (I think it is listed for ages 13 and up…I can’t remember how old you said your daughter was.)
Comment by Rori — July 27, 2008 @ 9:26 pm
Yay…someone else like us…right down to the blended family! Now I have to go so I can read your archives. Sorry it took so long to find ya!
Comment by The Butterfly Temptress — July 29, 2008 @ 10:50 pm
Lovely post! Another great YA novel is Blood and Chocolate by Annette Curtis Klause:-D It’s amazing to look back on the books I read as a young teen and how they’re reflected in my current relationships.
Comment by Just a Lurker — July 30, 2008 @ 5:13 am
DragonMage, Well said! And I hope you like Twilight.
Rori, I will check out that book. Thanks for the tip.
Welcome, Butterfly Temptress!
JustaLurker, I actually think Blood & Chocolate is even better and more D/s than Twilight. I almost wrote a post based on it. GREAT book!
xoAmy
Comment by Amy — July 30, 2008 @ 8:37 am
Oh Amy, I’d love to hear your thoughts on Blood and Chocolate
Comment by Just a Lurker — August 4, 2008 @ 4:38 am
Great post, I absolutley agree about Edward! Amazing to find that so clearly depicted in a book written for the YA market. Of course, there has been tons of spillover to us adults!
Comment by agent — August 7, 2008 @ 1:02 pm